[alchemyandlore]

Ok looking into my first pistol. I have only shot a Desert Eagle, I believe .45, and had a longer barrel my friends uncle said. I don't know really anything about them other than I loved the power and immense kick. I'm a go big or go home kinda guy but also have a budget. I really don't know anything about em. I want something with definite killing power due to it will be for protection of my family. I will most likely carry it every now and then with a permit but do not care about size or weight issue as long as i holster it in some way. I'm not saying I want a mess and a big hole in them but yeah. You guys are the experts, what do I need?

 

[UncleFudd]

First, welcome to the forum.

I don't know your geographical area but ther are some firsts IMHO for people such as yourself, getting started. Congrats on admitting that you are new and of limited knowledge. If you keep that in mind and listen, there are a number of very knowledgeable people on the forum and probably in your area that will try very hard to help you make wise decisions having to do with all phases of firearms. There are a few who will work very hard to seperate you from your money with tall tales and loads of BS and you need to sperate the two.

As for the Desert Eagle, I am not sure they made them in 45 as opposed to thr 44 mag and the 50 AE. They made the Baby EAgle in 40 and 9MM also all of them IMO very fine guns. If you shot the big boomer it was most likely the 44 mag or the 50 AE. However at this point don't become fixated on calibers. Everything from 22 to the 500s will work, they all make a mess and I suppose all or any of them could be a choice for a HD gun.
Next, see if you have a range in your immediate area that has a rental program. My advice would be to go and introduce yourself, tell them of your interests and then rent and shoot all of the guns you can in the models you like best or that are suggested by management or the instructors at the facility. Purchasing guns especially handguns is personal and has variables when choosing your own, ie; What are you going to use it for, what caliber can you handle effectivly, what is your physical stature, what is your budget for the initial purchase as well as for buying lots of ammo to become and to stay proficient, what are your particular surroundings or where do you live, (apt. or home) and how is it situated, what is the composition of the walls etc., are you going to carry this gun regularly or will it be a home gun? These are just a few things that should be taken into consideration along with whether or not you plan to have your wife be an integral part of your HD program. In other words, if this is to be primarily (a waste IMO) for HD then is she going to be expected to become as proficient as you with this gun or will she have her own to become proficient and use?Regardless, if it is a gun you choose for HD then at any given time she will or may be forced to pick it up and use it effectively. Having said that, she MUST become very good with your gun so keep her in mind as well in your decision making process

Next, or even before you buy, you may want to go to some firearms classes to get some first hand or hands on ideas of what to use and what works best for you. In my classes I offer the use of any firearm in my rental counter as often as a person likes (they only buy ammo) to help them make an informed decision. You may have some instructors in your area who are prepared to offer something similar and it would be wise as well as worth every cent to take advantage of it.

Last for this post, you may find that either you don't want or need a gun at all ( it happens once in a while after I finish the "law and legal" portion of my class) or that the gun you need and the one that will best suit your situation is a shotgun as opposed to any handgun in the arsenal.

Take your time, ask lots of questions and listen. Listen especially to those who have no vested interest in your decisions and who wish only to help you and for the most part you can't go wrong..


Good luck and I hope this helps a little.

If you have any more questions and want to be more specific, feel free to PM me and I will try to help if I can.

UF

 

[wwb]

I'd like to add something, but UF pretty well covered it.

The only recommendation I could add is that you get a .22 rimfire for your first handgun. To shoot well, in addition to shooting properly (lessons), you must shoot LOTS, and the .22LR is the least expensive by far, as well as having minimal recoil and muzzle blast. A boomer may be fun for the first few rounds, but after a hundred or so, it ain't so much fun any more.

If you get a quality used .22, you will be able to sell it in the future at minimal or no loss to get a larger caliber.... but I'm willing to bet you won't part with it.

In your quest for a larger caliber, don't overlook a good wheelgun in .357 Mag, .41 Mag, or .44 Mag. If you end up being a poor, power-crazed soul (like some others who shall remain anonymous), you can't beat a wheelgun.... .454 Casull, .475 Linebaugh, .500 S&W, .460 S&W, .480 Ruger..... there's no bottom feeder that can match 'em for brute power.

 

[UncleFudd]

Thanks for the vote of confidence wb.

I agree with you wholeheartedly and your input has a lot of merit about the 22.

As posted by one of the other cremudgeons on another, previous post, replying to the same question "the 22 can feed you and protect you as well". Don't sell that little pellet short on power. It has killed more game two and four legged, than any other two calibers combined. In 1985 I personally dropped a 5 pt bull elk with my nylon 66, one shot. No I would not make it my first choice as a HD gun but neither would a handgun be my first choice in the first place. Neither would it be my choice at all for big game hunting, but I was in the right place at the right time and had the permit and harvested the bull.

And as you pointed out so wisely, it is sooooo much fun to shoot you will find the time to go out plinking with it and as a result become very good with a handgun and the transition is smooth then to any other handgun you might choose.

You can also help your missus become very good with a gun as well because it has no recoil and very little noise and don't forget the effect noise has on our women folk when it comes to shooting handguns. They are born with a fear of loud noise. Yes they can and do ovecome it but the chances of them doing so with a handgun if you take them out their very first experience and hand them your trusy 357 with full house loads. More often than not, it will be their last experience as well.

Take care

UF

 

[alchemyandlore]

Thank you both to start off. I have shot a .22 of some sort and not a huge fan. I believe the Desert Eagle would have been a .44 in the case there is no .45 'cause I know there was a 4 in it I will be living in an apartment for a few years and I am very glad you said that because I don't want to be shooting through a wall if I were to miss the person entering my home. I'm in NC and firearm classes are required to carry the gun so I will take many classes along with the safety but soon I will be moving to FL anyways in which I have no idea how it works there. As for shotgun, my dad owns a 20 gauge which I'm sure I will inherit along with his .22 pistol and rifle. I have shot enough guns to know I like shotguns but want pistols. I intend on eventually having a small collection of maybe 10 pistols to go with my MANY other weapons I collect. Thank you both for your info it was very useful.

-James

 

[alchemyandlore]

Also my future wife has been around guns and shot them her whole life with her father. No worries there.

 

[drsfmd]

Re: re: First pistol and I know nothing.

As for the Desert Eagle, I am not sure they made them in 45 as opposed to thr 44 mag and the 50 AE. They made the Baby EAgle in 40 and 9MM also all of them IMO very fine guns.

They made the Baby Eagle in .45acp as well. I have one... never been able to find a fitted holster for it.

 

[Roadkill Bill]

If you just enjoy recoil, get a small .357. It will give you plenty of torque, and the ammo is a lot cheaper than .50AE! It will be easy to carry and conceal, and you can always practice with .38s when you start to tire. Plus, there ain't a better man stopper out there than a good ol' .357.

 

[alchemyandlore]

Re: re: First pistol and I know nothing.

If you just enjoy recoil, get a small .357. It will give you plenty of torque, and the ammo is a lot cheaper than .50AE! It will be easy to carry and conceal, and you can always practice with .38s when you start to tire. Plus, there ain't a better man stopper out there than a good ol' .357.

Does this gun inflict a good bit of pain..lol. I mean like I said I want a gun that says "I'm about to mess you up" And I don't really care about concealment or size. I actually prolly prefer bigger just for the look. I will look into them. When everyone talks about calibur like is there a major difference in what each caliber does for the different size bullets or how does that work?

 

[UncleFudd]

Alchemy;

Are you serious? What the hell is "Look Like its going to mess you up"?

Me thinks you had your tea glass a little to close to your elbow when you typed this response.

But on the off chance that you ARE serious here goes at least from my standpoint which is about 35 yrs of teaching and working with both law enforcement and civilian self defense problems.

ANY gun will mess you up and cause you a great deal of pain and discomfort, IF YOU HIT WHAT YOU SHOOT AT.
They don'y hurt one damned bit if you miss. I believe what I and others have been saying is to get a smaller cal which will also mess you up and cause discomfort, but you will learn to shoot accurately and to handle a pistol properly.

Most people do not or will not spend enough time with their handguns to get really good with them. That is even more prevalent when the gun is big, with a big bore and lots of noise and recoil. If they are big and have tremendous recoil nd lots of recoil, they are NOT FUN to shoot. If they are not fun, you will not shoot them to ever become really good.
If you are not really good, the chances of hitting what you shoot at even at very close range is nil especially under duress..
There is a reason why you read about police officers shooting 33 rounds at a perp at 12 feet or less and not hitting him a single round.
It also has to do with all of the physical and psychological changes that affect the body at the time you are forced to shoot.
But why not find a gun of smaller caliber to begin with to learn to shoot first and also to learn the how to of pistol handling. In addition they are cheap, not noisy and are less expensive to practice and to become very good with.
IF you had to use it to defend yourself they will work as you will have a much better chance of hitting your target even under duress than with a big gun with a large bore that you have hardly ever fired.

The bottom line is as I said, any gun will make a mess of a human depending upon where they are hit.
(I rolled on a love triangle shooting in Ogden UT back in the 60s where the husb shot the boyfriend with a .243 at about 6 feet. The bullet hit exactly on the point of the adams apple but did not exit, it hit the spine and went up to the brain and stayed. There was not enough blood to stain his t shirt).

On the other hand I saw a guy shot with a 22 from above the rt eye it went along the top of the skull and exited the back of the head. Did not kill him but it was more blood than any other wound I had ever seen with any caliber.

So hurting and making a mess are possible only if you hit your target and unless you become very good with your intended pistol the chances of you ever hitting your taget under duress are very limited.
In fact they are limited even if you become VERY good but you give yourself more of a chance if you get good first and then choose any caliber that floats your boat.

The looks of a gun will not hurt or mess up or even drive off a bad guy who is bent upon huting you and your loved ones.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone

UF

 

[alchemyandlore]

lmao...i think you mis interpreted me. I shouldnt have used that phrase it is halfway an inside joke. but yeah ill just delete it cuz deffffffinately misinterpreted. sorry..lol

 

[Rbts]

Uncle Fudd..

I am not in too dissimiliar a place.... which is that I am a newbie. I bought a 380 recently... because I just thought a fellow ought to have a gun... then I realized that he needed to shoot it a little bit... but... where can you shoot? So I joined a local shooting club, but I see that mostly they are into target shooting... with red dot scopes and all of that.

So now I have a 22 also, with a red dot scope, and I am participating in some target shooting... which is very interesting, and of course not as easy as they made it look... although those scopes are ioncredible... and I actually can hit the target most of the time now.

I am not sure though that target shooting with a scope is exactly the right kind of practice for getting proficient at carrying a gun for home defense. Seems like a guy would just want to go out plinking... shooting at cans or whatever... you know... up close stuff... but where can you do that at?

I am not sayng that the 380 was the best choice for HD, but it is what I have at this time. I am trying to carry the gun with me and handle it, just to increase my familiarity with it, and trying to visualize various circumstances, and how I ought to respond, but to really practice with shooting at stuff in various directions, at close range... I do not know how to do that.

 

[UncleFudd]

Hey Mr rbts.

It is good to know there is another good guy out there practicing and shooting and asking questions.

I believe you are interested in firearms for self and home defense from reading your post.

If so and remember this is only my humble opinion. Although I have been an active instructor for LE and civilian for many years. Others will have more to add but I will try to give you a beginning opinion at least.

First I don't believe self defense and home defense are fought with the same firearm.
And I want to be very clear in that my first and foremost lesson would be to advise you to work on awareness and avoidance. If you become very good at both of these disciplines you will seldom have to use or choose a tool to defend your home or yourself. Learn how to harden your perimeters to make it look so difficult for a potential bad guy to approach you or your home that they choose the other guy. I mean this with all my heart.
In 35 years of teaching self and home defense this has been my corner stone and it seems to work as I have been made aware of less than a dozen of my students to date who have had to use a tool to defend themselves and their families.

Now having said that.

For home defense there is no substitute for a good shotgun and when choosing keep it simple. It does not have to be a 12 ga and it should be something your wife can and will willingly pick up and participate in your training with you.
For self defense (carry) again this is a very personal choice matter and what works for me will not work best for you.
You are right, a gun with a red dot scope is not a gun to carry and expect under duress to be able to get it out and into action with any modicum of speed or dexterity.
If you have a range in your area with a rental program, I would sugggest you go there and talk to the instructors or sales people, (remember they are sales people) and get some ideas of what they have and if you are at a complete loss then find out what your local law enforcement is using. But ask questions and remember what works for them is only a reference to you until you have been able to try the actual guns.
The types and models of handguns are legion and most if they are top of the line manuf are good to go with. But you need to find one that fits you and your needs. Look at your geographical location the walls of your home the proximity of your walls to others in your neighborhood, your physical stature etc.
To begin with, a good 22 cal pistol is great for learning how to shoot and to become familiar with a handgun inexpensively.
Good 22s can be had in revolver or auto and are a lot of fun to shoot. When you are ready and have some experience you can transition very easily and smoothly to any caliber or type of gun with ease and confidence.
Also don't let people tell you that a 22 isn't enough "stopping" power.
It will cause enough pain and discomfort to do the job in most circumstances. The key is to get good and to stay good and a good 22 will help you do both at a much reduced cost of operation. A 22 is the most accurate of all calibers in handgun under any circumstances and will do just fine in an outright emergency.
Open sights are the best for self defense and if or when you transfer to a bigger gun (cal) then perhaps a trijican front sight added.
I will not go beyond this for now but if you have more questions give me a pm and I will always try to help.

I hope this is of some enlightenment without using too much time or space on the forum. :wink:

UF

 

[kcw12]

alchemyandlore,

These fellas are right. The weekend i turned 21 i went pistol shopping. What i was looking for was a cheaper, .22 cal wheel gun. I found a new Hertiage arms for a very good price, and bought it.

Then i caught a sale of 22 lr ammo at rural king, for 99 cents a box. Went home, and set up a shooting gallery of cans plastic bottles and old toasters, and various other items.(a toaster will stop a 22 round). I shot about 1500 rounds that weekend, got used to shooting the wheel gun. Decided i needed to shoot it more, so i been shooting it about every weekend since, but not that many shells (50-100).

I bought me a cheaper semi auto .380 and shot it some, its gonna make a very good truck gun.

Now I'm looking for a good used CZ 75 or something like that, in 40 S&W or 45 acp.

Start small man, then go big, any of em will kill if you can hit what ya point it at.

 

[redrick]

if you want something to carry and something that kicks you then try a glock or some other brand of semi 357 . but i would choose a 45 semi , but that is just me . take a safety coarse so you don't accidentally discharge it . if you can call your shooting range and see if you can rent a pistol to try before you buy something that you don't like . that being said i have never bought a pistol that i didn't like , i do have some that i don't shoot as much as others .