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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey everybody nice site!

I just picked up my first Handgun and as my name obviously gives away, it was a S&W Sigma SW40VE. I did my research and found a HUGE amount of consistent data saying it was super reliable and made very well. I also learned about the 10-12lbs trigger pull. I didn't have much money and everything else was way too much OTD (I'm in Cali too) So I went with the Sigma. I LOVE the grip/feel of it in your hand and it doesn't look too bad at all (Stainless). I'm pretty much determined to get VERY good with it and use it in some Competitions just because I like being different and going against the grain. I know if I can get close to some of the other people in the matches, I will most likely out shoot them with a "Competition Gun". It's also of course for Home protection so don't flame me for just getting it to do what it wasn't designed for. Anyway I just picked it up yesterday(Layaway and 11 Day waiting), cleaned it, took it to the range, and put 70rds through it. I have only shot a Sigma (Same model) once(50rds) so please be kind lol. Here are pics of my 2 best runs and some of the gun. I shot them only at 20ft out and was trying to dial it in and get use to it. It will take me a few trips to really get a good feel for how to be accurate with it. The guy at the range said my groups where looking good, just wanted to know what others think,

Thanks!







 

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I hadn't checked in for awhile and found your post. I didn't want you to think we weren't a friendly bunch here, Mr. Sigma. Welcome to the forum. Glad you're here. Let me encourage you to join the NRA if you haven't already. Those of you in California especially need the help.
 

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Sigma dot, Welcome to the forum.

Out of all the hype that the sigma's get, they are a fun gun to shoot.
They are a Great entry level pistol. Good price also. Other than the New York trigger they have.... They aren't that bad at all. But you'll get use to it after a few hundred rounds....

Pretty good grooping for just starting out.

Here are some things that might help you out. You can print some of these and use them as guides to see how or what you might be doing wrong...

http://www.gunblast.com/SWSigma9.htm

http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/sear ... l/Shooting

http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2005 ... tions.html

http://www.tackdriver.com/pix0703/correction.jpg

http://www.targetshooting.ca/docs/grp-analysis.pdf

http://www.bullseyepistol.com/training.htm


Again, Welcome to the forum.
 

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Your groups are good for a first time out.

I love your drive to try your hand at competition. Are you intending to shoot combat style competitions or slow fire accuracy? I think that you will find more people with average guns than you think at local competitions. There are different classes and you shouldn't have any trouble with that gun in your class.

20ft is a good self defense distance to practice at. Actually most self defense instructors will tell you to shoot at 21ft because that distance and less is where most self defense shots are taken. I never shoot any further than 21ft with my Glocks for just this reason.

I used to shoot in a Slow Fire Center Fire league. We shot at 75ft and it was a lot of fun. All the "A" shooters loaded their own ammo and never had a hit outside the 9 ring. I was a "B" shooter and managed to stay inside the 9 most of the time with an occasional 8, but I didn't create my own loads. At this level, you would need a better gun. Each gun has it's own limitations. Most autos will not group better than 2". Fixed barrel guns can do better. I can get a 1" group with my Dan Wesson .357 revolver. Without making my own loads I don't think I can do any better.
 

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Sigmadot;

Once again, welcome to the forum. As others have said, yours is a n OK entry level gun but if you plan to shoot it a LOT, I suspect yo may have troubles with it. Only time and rounds down range will tell with your specific copy.
As others have said, play with it and get used to it including the heavy trigger. that will take some getting used too, but with time and lots of shooting you will overcome most of it and be able to close up the groups.
However as Rastoff and XD have said practice inside the 21 ft for SD applications. Better yet, imagine the largest to the smallest rooms in your home. Those are the distances most important to you or to anyone who is serious about self defense training with handguns.

I turned 65 today and my hands are not as good as once they were. I have become recoil sensitive and have had to drop my 45 Commander for the lightweight commander in 9MM.
I only have about 40,000 rounds through the one I now shoot since I built it three years ago.
Here is the targets I shot Friday at 20 and 50 ft.
I do not use a U or V notch rear sight for my SD guns. I made my own ghost ring and had Trijicon install the glow in the dark inserts. The ghost ring is not a bullseye competition sight for absolute accuracy, but the fastest and most accurate SD sight I have ever used on any gun for man sized targets, day or night.



I was shooting Mozambique or two the head and one to the chest rapid fire on this target.

Good luck, enjoy your firearm(s) and all the wonderful people you will meet who are fellow shooter/gunowners.

UncleFudd
 

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Happy Birthday to you,

Happy Birthday To you,

Happy Birthday UncleFudd,

Happy Birthday to youuuuuu...


Happy Birthday UncleFudd
Sorry to make you sing your own song, but that's the way it is online.... hehehehe :lol:

P.S. Nice groups. But why no smiley face for the head shots? LOL.....Give er' a try next time....it's fun..

Hope I can still shoot that good when i'm your age. only 15 yrs to go.... :D

As Always, Stay Safe.
 

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Happy B-Day UF!!!

Nice groups!! 8)

Edit: Tell me more about that ghost ring ..... Looks sweet. You say you made it .... How? Out of what?
 

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Happy B-Day, UncleFudd! And impressive Mozambiques. Only 40k? Yikes...that's a lot of brass.

MrSigma - nice to have another Bay Area shooter on the boards! As per your shooting, you're off to a great start - looks like your shots are all centered, so you've avoided the biggest "new-shooter" problem - the seven-o-clock flinch. Way to go! Glad you're satisfied with your gun - it's nice to be gunfighting, not fighting with the gun...only thing I can think of is a nice sharp front sight focus and practice.
 

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Thanks to all for the B day good wishes. At my age I try not to think about them too much. But with all my grandkids and students I wind up with more activities now than I ever have and just as with you guys whom I have never met, the wonderful thoughts and good wishes make the day better than it has ever been.

Mr. sigmadot40; I have been an active instructor and training counselor for the past 35 years, the last 20 full time. I built an indoor shooting range from the ground up and it is the first state of the art indoor range in Az. I only mention this so you have some idea of my tendency to try to help others with their shooting. You can have a peek at my place at www.caswells.com. My bio is under the list of instructors. The old guy with all the gray hair.
Bunnyman is right about your groups. If you were anticipating or had wrong trigger finger placement, you would not have the groups as shown. So follow his advice, practice a lot. BTW, even dry fire is an excellent way to become very good, very fast. I have my students do it a lot, every day and get to the range for live fire as often as possible.
your groups will improve almost exponentially.
Rastoff also made an excellent point IMHO about distance. Practicing with a pistol is normally done with some self defense in mind. As I said in my other reply, that is encouraged at the room sizes of your home where many or most self defense situations occur. Therefore his mention of shooting inside 21 feet. then, if you decide to go competition, you will shoot the distances for the particular discipline.
I am very fortunate to own a wonderful indoor range and have the opportunity to work with and meet great people every day. My love and work if you can call it so is to help people with their shooting be it handgun or tactical long guns.
So I put a LOT of rounds downrange nearly every day.
I have had to change calibers due to my hands and problems with old age. I have been shooting a Lightweight Commander but had to change to same gun in 9MM.
For me it is imperative as I am sure it is to all of you to be very, very good with my Self defense gun. So being as I encourage students all day to practice I feel I must do so myself.
IF you are interested in self defense, then accuracy and familiarization with your firearm is the most important product to acquire. I can tell you guys if it happens, God forbid you may be able to get one shot ONLY, maybe. Can you afford a miss?

Mr sigmadot, I am sure this is only the beginning and as said, join the NRA and be supportive in person as well as financially. I have no doubt you have been bitten so good luck, welcome to the forum and keep us posted with more pics of your accomplishments. We are truly interested in seeing fellow shooters grow.

As for the ghost rings, guys I am not computer literate, so I do not want to hijack this thread. I am not sure how that is done, but it seems to me the question by sigmadot40 had to do with HIS accuracy. I will not go into any detail about my guns more than I have aleady done. If I have hijacked the thread at this point, please accept my apology.

for those interested in the ghost rings, I believe it is an interesting story. look at a "new post". I will do a picture and explanation on it under this same forum. I will do it in the morning so it will be up by afternoon. Thanks again to all of you for the warm wishes.

Great bunch of guys and gals here.

UF
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
WHOA! I'm sorry I kind of lost th site lol. I thought I saved it in my favorites but didn't and could not find the site for a while. I need to thank you all at once for your responses and input. I started I new thread not even seeing this one (thought it was gone or something) with NEW range shots and it looks like I got WAY better. If you guys don't mind, we can continue this in that new thread.

Title:

I'm Loving My Sigma!!
http://www.pistolworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=1896
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

xd.40 said:
Sigma dot, Welcome to the forum.

Out of all the hype that the sigma's get, they are a fun gun to shoot.
They are a Great entry level pistol. Good price also. Other than the New York trigger they have.... They aren't that bad at all. But you'll get use to it after a few hundred rounds....

Pretty good grooping for just starting out.

Here are some things that might help you out. You can print some of these and use them as guides to see how or what you might be doing wrong...

http://www.gunblast.com/SWSigma9.htm

http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/sear ... l/Shooting

http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2005 ... tions.html

http://www.tackdriver.com/pix0703/correction.jpg

http://www.targetshooting.ca/docs/grp-analysis.pdf

http://www.bullseyepistol.com/training.htm


Again, Welcome to the forum.
Thanx for the links, I did take a look at them before I lost the site and they were very helpful!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

Bunnyman said:
Happy B-Day, UncleFudd! And impressive Mozambiques. Only 40k? Yikes...that's a lot of brass.

MrSigma - nice to have another Bay Area shooter on the boards! As per your shooting, you're off to a great start - looks like your shots are all centered, so you've avoided the biggest "new-shooter" problem - the seven-o-clock flinch. Way to go! Glad you're satisfied with your gun - it's nice to be gunfighting, not fighting with the gun...only thing I can think of is a nice sharp front sight focus and practice.
Thanks, I'm loving the Sigma a lot and glad to hear such good reviews of my shooting. Yea I was shooting with the 7-o-clock flinch in mind. I practice dry firing a lot and try to make sure I don't flinch as much as possible, but I have to admit I got a lot of info from some Todd Jerret Videos so i'm cheating a bit lol. please keep the input and opinions coming!
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

Rastoff said:
Your groups are good for a first time out.

I love your drive to try your hand at competition. Are you intending to shoot combat style competitions or slow fire accuracy? I think that you will find more people with average guns than you think at local competitions. There are different classes and you shouldn't have any trouble with that gun in your class.

20ft is a good self defense distance to practice at. Actually most self defense instructors will tell you to shoot at 21ft because that distance and less is where most self defense shots are taken. I never shoot any further than 21ft with my Glocks for just this reason.

I used to shoot in a Slow Fire Center Fire league. We shot at 75ft and it was a lot of fun. All the "A" shooters loaded their own ammo and never had a hit outside the 9 ring. I was a "B" shooter and managed to stay inside the 9 most of the time with an occasional 8, but I didn't create my own loads. At this level, you would need a better gun. Each gun has it's own limitations. Most autos will not group better than 2". Fixed barrel guns can do better. I can get a 1" group with my Dan Wesson .357 revolver. Without making my own loads I don't think I can do any better.
Thanx, I plan on getting into ISPC (whatever cat that fits in), I've seen videos and it looks pretty fun. Also there is a local range (Richmond Rod&Gun) that hosts official matches and gives classes. I'm not going for it until I get faster at acquiring targets and very consistent. The range that is really close to me is San Leandro Optimist and they have a small Outside Steel Shoot range open on Saturdays. The last time I went I watched them shoot and it is pretty laid back, not a competition, and looks like very good practice. So I'm going to wait until I can shoot tight consistent groups at, at least 25 yards, while being able to acquiring the target fast(basically shoot faster) before I go outside to the steel shoot. then When I get good/fast there, I will go to Richmond and take the ISPC class and get in a match. My dream is to either almost match, match, or beat some people with lightly modded guns (like lighter trigger springs, sights, etc) with my stock sigma.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

UncleFudd said:
Sigmadot;

Once again, welcome to the forum. As others have said, yours is a n OK entry level gun but if you plan to shoot it a LOT, I suspect yo may have troubles with it. Only time and rounds down range will tell with your specific copy.
As others have said, play with it and get used to it including the heavy trigger. that will take some getting used too, but with time and lots of shooting you will overcome most of it and be able to close up the groups.
However as Rastoff and XD have said practice inside the 21 ft for SD applications. Better yet, imagine the largest to the smallest rooms in your home. Those are the distances most important to you or to anyone who is serious about self defense training with handguns.

I turned 65 today and my hands are not as good as once they were. I have become recoil sensitive and have had to drop my 45 Commander for the lightweight commander in 9MM.
I only have about 40,000 rounds through the one I now shoot since I built it three years ago.
Here is the targets I shot Friday at 20 and 50 ft.
I do not use a U or V notch rear sight for my SD guns. I made my own ghost ring and had Trijicon install the glow in the dark inserts. The ghost ring is not a bullseye competition sight for absolute accuracy, but the fastest and most accurate SD sight I have ever used on any gun for man sized targets, day or night.
Good luck, enjoy your firearm(s) and all the wonderful people you will meet who are fellow shooter/gunowners.

UncleFudd
Thanks, It's been shooting flawlessly so far but as with any gun it will jam at some point. But from the hundreds of reviews I have looked at, it eats every kind of ammo and rarely fails. Some people have over 1000rds through it without a fail. I heard the older models( C, E) had some trouble but the VE/GVE models are flawless. I like your sights, it does look like you could acquire your attacker/intruder VERY quickly with it, nice shooting too!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

UncleFudd said:
Thanks to all for the B day good wishes. At my age I try not to think about them too much. But with all my grandkids and students I wind up with more activities now than I ever have and just as with you guys whom I have never met, the wonderful thoughts and good wishes make the day better than it has ever been.

Mr. sigmadot40; I have been an active instructor and training counselor for the past 35 years, the last 20 full time. I built an indoor shooting range from the ground up and it is the first state of the art indoor range in Az. I only mention this so you have some idea of my tendency to try to help others with their shooting. You can have a peek at my place at www.caswells.com. My bio is under the list of instructors. The old guy with all the gray hair.
Wow a lot of experience here, thanks for your input, I look forward to hearing from you a lot! Nice site/range/store, if I ever save up enough to get to AZ on one of my Vegas vacation runs (gotta drive cant fly) I will stop by and patronize for sure.

UncleFudd said:
Bunnyman is right about your groups. If you were anticipating or had wrong trigger finger placement, you would not have the groups as shown. So follow his advice, practice a lot. BTW, even dry fire is an excellent way to become very good, very fast. I have my students do it a lot, every day and get to the range for live fire as often as possible.
your groups will improve almost exponentially.
WOW good to know the info I had found early on and my instincts were pretty good on what to do. Before I saw any of the replies to this thread, I was practicing trigger finger placement, correct grip, while dry firing almost everyday if not everyday and at night. I found myself just watching tv dry firing sometimes, and aiming and stuff/dry firing during commercials. One thing I find interesting with trigger finger placement though is that if you try to put the absolute PAD of your finger on the trigger and pull, it is VERY hard to pull the trigger (with the sigma). But if (with the sigma) you place the trigger towards the back of the first link of your finger kinda resting it on the beginning of the joint for support and compensate a little (if need) with your grip to make sure you shoot straight, it is MUCH easier to pull the trigger and you can still do it very straight on. But if your finger is any further past that point, you will get the yanked off shots. I think my aim has improved just like you said for sure, check the new thread with the pics!

UncleFudd said:
Rastoff also made an excellent point IMHO about distance. Practicing with a pistol is normally done with some self defense in mind. As I said in my other reply, that is encouraged at the room sizes of your home where many or most self defense situations occur. Therefore his mention of shooting inside 21 feet. then, if you decide to go competition, you will shoot the distances for the particular discipline.
I am very fortunate to own a wonderful indoor range and have the opportunity to work with and meet great people every day. My love and work if you can call it so is to help people with their shooting be it handgun or tactical long guns.
So I put a LOT of rounds downrange nearly every day.
I have had to change calibers due to my hands and problems with old age. I have been shooting a Lightweight Commander but had to change to same gun in 9MM.
For me it is imperative as I am sure it is to all of you to be very, very good with my Self defense gun. So being as I encourage students all day to practice I feel I must do so myself.
IF you are interested in self defense, then accuracy and familiarization with your firearm is the most important product to acquire. I can tell you guys if it happens, God forbid you may be able to get one shot ONLY, maybe. Can you afford a miss?

Mr sigmadot, I am sure this is only the beginning and as said, join the NRA and be supportive in person as well as financially. I have no doubt you have been bitten so good luck, welcome to the forum and keep us posted with more pics of your accomplishments. We are truly interested in seeing fellow shooters grow.

As for the ghost rings, guys I am not computer literate, so I do not want to hijack this thread. I am not sure how that is done, but it seems to me the question by sigmadot40 had to do with HIS accuracy. I will not go into any detail about my guns more than I have aleady done. If I have hijacked the thread at this point, please accept my apology.

for those interested in the ghost rings, I believe it is an interesting story. look at a "new post". I will do a picture and explanation on it under this same forum. I will do it in the morning so it will be up by afternoon. Thanks again to all of you for the warm wishes.

Great bunch of guys and gals here.

UF
Thanks, when I go in to shoot I usually (have rented handguns a few times before) do most of it close but I will send a target or 2 down mid range and just for kicks almost all the way down. This last time I used 3 targets, did one at 5-7 Yards, another at 10-15, and another at about 20 yards (100 rds). That's most likely how I will shoot every time now. I did read that most "shootouts" happen at 20ft or less and target shooting or competition shooting skills are really useless at that range. I do keep that in mind while at the range, I will probably start using a 4th target at 3 yards and kinda of shoot without really looking through the sights, ya
know like look at the target but have the sights in viewing range; kinda like using your forward looking perifial vision. I figure if I do that a lot, at close range I should be able to send shots right where I want them without having to fully aim and squeeze. I'll give it a try next time and post that pic up as well. Again thanks for all the info and input, I can't wait to see what you think of the new pics!
 

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Sigma: You are well into the great adventure of pistol competition regardless of which discipline that you chose to enter. You will meet shooters whose abilities will seem almost magical (maybe you are one of them). A word of advice - practice; there's no substitute for rounds downrange.

Added note: Rastoff wrote that "Most autos will not group better than 2"." As far as off the shelf, run-of-the-mill autos are concerned that is most likely true. In competition, however, a competitive auto will group ALL its shots inside two inches at 50 yards. Not every auto available is able to be worked on in such a way as to produce this kind of accuracy. The 1911's are pretty much the best choice for the accuracy stated.
Pete
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

darkgael said:
Sigma: You are well into the great adventure of pistol competition regardless of which discipline that you chose to enter. You will meet shooters whose abilities will seem almost magical (maybe you are one of them). A word of advice - practice; there's no substitute for rounds downrange.

Added note: Rastoff wrote that "Most autos will not group better than 2"." As far as off the shelf, run-of-the-mill autos are concerned that is most likely true. In competition, however, a competitive auto will group ALL its shots inside two inches at 50 yards. Not every auto available is able to be worked on in such a way as to produce this kind of accuracy. The 1911's are pretty much the best choice for the accuracy stated.
Pete
Thanks for the advice, I do plan on getting a 1911 in the future(in addition). I do see how a lot of people use them for comps and how accurate they are. As far as practicing I try to go as much as possible but I'm looking for work as we speak so I don't have much ammo money. I try to go every weekend. I'll be going today to shoot off another 100 rds.
 

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Re: re: New Guy Here, Hows My Aim?? (Pics)

frizzen said:
Could you please tell me how to post pictures like you did. Thanks Phil
Frizzen,

First you need to upload any pictures you want to post onto a site such as photobucket.com http://photobucket.com/ it is free, you just need to register.

Then you can copy a link to use as a full size photo or just a thumbnail size photo and paste it in your post here.

It is pretty simple once you learn how...

Good luck...

As always, Stay Safe.
 

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Well I must really be stupid on posting pictures. What I see
here is pictures with the messages. I don't see links to click
on to take me to the picture, I see the pictures, like the two
targets posted at the begining of this post. When I posted
a link to a picture it shows up as a link and you have to click
on it. I gess I just don't get it. Thank you anway for your help
 
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